[3.5] Spells and Ranged Attacks

[Zoiks!]

I'm looking for some rule cites that cover whether or not ranged attacks
via spells draw an attack of opportunity. And whether using the ranged
attacks provided by a spell require seperate attacks to use.

This is how I work it currently...If a spell behaves as a thrown weapon
then it both draws attacks of opportunity and requires seperate attack
actions, since thrown weapons also do both. Currently I only know of a
couple spells this applies to, Produce Flame and Fire Seed...

Any help would be appreciated.

Zoiks!

[Michael Scott Brown]

Post by Zoiks!
I'm looking for some rule cites that cover whether or not ranged attacks
via spells draw an attack of opportunity. And whether using the ranged
attacks provided by a spell require seperate attacks to use.

Casting a ranged spell is *not* "attacking with a ranged weapon", for
all that some spells like Rays have many weapon-like qualities.
Casting a spell incurs AoO all of its own, however, so the point is
somewhat moot.

If and only if the spell creates a magical weapon for the caster to use
thereafter would the rules for weapons apply, at which point the ususal
punishments for needing additional Attack actions and making missile attacks
while in melee would apply. You correctly surmised that Fire Seeds was an
example of this sort of spell.

-Michael

[Zoiks!]

Michael Scott Brown says...

Post by Michael Scott Brown
Casting a ranged spell is *not* "attacking with a ranged weapon", for
all that some spells like Rays have many weapon-like qualities.
Casting a spell incurs AoO all of its own, however, so the point is
somewhat moot.
If and only if the spell creates a magical weapon for the caster to use
thereafter would the rules for weapons apply, at which point the ususal
punishments for needing additional Attack actions and making missile attacks
while in melee would apply. You correctly surmised that Fire Seeds was an
example of this sort of spell.

...

What about Produce Flame? To me it would seem to fall in the same
category as spells that create a weapon, but it's also similar to spells
that enchant the caster's hand with a magical attack...Currently I'm not
allowing any 'free' attacks with the casting of the spell, and it draws
attacks of opportunity when using it as a ranged weapon.

Thanks.

Zoiks!

[Michael Scott Brown]

Post by Zoiks!
What about Produce Flame? To me it would seem to fall in the same
category as spells that create a weapon, but it's also similar to spells
that enchant the caster's hand with a magical attack...Currently I'm not
allowing any 'free' attacks with the casting of the spell, and it draws
attacks of opportunity when using it as a ranged weapon.

CASTING SPELL PROVOKES ATTACKS OF OPPORTUNITY.
There is no room for some manner of "judgement call" there. It's a spell
like any other, requiring concentration to cast.

Your flaming hands can also be used in melee so it's not as if the
caster is "compelled" to eat AoO when attacking with this spell. And what's
the character doing casting or throwing things in melee anyway?

-Michael

[Senator Blutarsky]

Post by Zoiks!
What about Produce Flame? To me it would seem to fall in the same
category as spells that create a weapon, but it's also similar to spells
that enchant the caster's hand with a magical attack...

"Alternatively, you can hurl the flames up to 120
feet *as a thrown weapon*" (emphasis added). Trust
your instincts, Luke.

-Bluto

[Loren Davis]

Post by Zoiks!
What about Produce Flame? To me it would seem to fall in the same
category as spells that create a weapon, but it's also similar to spells
that enchant the caster's hand with a magical attack...Currently I'm not
allowing any 'free' attacks with the casting of the spell, and it draws
attacks of opportunity when using it as a ranged weapon.

I think this is incorrect. All quotes are from the SRD:

"You can strike an opponent with a melee touch attack, dealing fire damage
equal to 1d6 +1 point per caster level (maximum +5). Alternatively, you can
hurl the flames up to 120 feet as a thrown weapon. When doing so, you
attack with a ranged touch attack (with no range penalty)"

When used in melee: "Touching an opponent with a touch spell is considered
to be an armed attack and therefore does not provoke attacks of
opportunity. However, the act of casting a spell does provoke an attack of
opportunity."

When used at range: attacking with a thrown weapon does provoke attacks of
opportunity, and so does casting a spell as a standard action. I can think
of three reasons why it might matter that you provoke attacks of
opportunity for both: if you Quicken the spell, casting it no longer
provokes, but hurling the flames still does; if you cast defensively,
casting it no longer provokes, but hurling the flames still does; and an
opponent with Combat Reflexes can take one attack per opportunity.